Global Kids' Online Leadership Program

Barry Gkid: Thank you all for coming today, to this special youth panel during Global Kids anniversary week in TSL. We hope you have been enjoying the fun stuff - the birthday cake building contest, the scavenger hunt, the volcano countdown (watch your head!), the birthday cards and balloons - and enjoy the live events like this one.
Barry Gkid: Okay, so, I will introduce the topic and then pass things over to our teen panelists.
Barry Gkid: Many teenagers find their thinking disrespected, on a regular basis. They are often said to be self-centered, concerned only with themselves or trivial matters. Weighty world issues bore them.
Barry Gkid: Many teenagers often have their bodies controlled, told where they have to be, what they have to do and, at times, find themselves exploited with no place to turn for help.
Barry Gkid: As a result, many young people, after fighting and resisting this daily, often socially sanctioned, mistreatment, slowly forget how competent they are, how smart they are, how important they are. They come to believe the lies they have been fed about themselves.
Barry Gkid: This is sometimes called internalized oppression, when a group that is targeted comes to believe the misinformation said about their group.
Barry Gkid: Many organizations like Global Kids believe that it is never too late for youth to reclaim their voice, to reclaim their power. That on their own or with the help of thoughtful adults, they can develop critical thinking about themselves, and the world around them, and see their voice as an invaluable contribution to improving the world.
Barry Gkid: That is what we do with youth after school, in New York City, working with students to develop their critical voices and abilities for expressing it around local and global issues.
Barry Gkid: This is the perspective we bring to our work in TSL, which is perhaps the largest youth-run community in the world, perhaps in history. This is a place where teens take on leadership to run business, develop activities, educate, manage property, and more. The opportunities to develop leadership are unlimited.
Barry Gkid: We at GK do not take our role here as adult lightly. There is a role we can play, supporting the development of those in TSL as empowered youth leaders. At the same time, we know that as adults we are not exempt from the same ball of confusion that leads adults to mistreat youth. So we understand at times when our presence might not be fully welcome, no matter how "good" we act.

Barry Gkid: It is in that context that, last Fall, Global Kids began to wonder about the general issue of adults in online teen spaces... and what TSL residents might have to say about this issue.
Barry Gkid: Last January we moderated an online discussion, which can be found on our blog,http://www.HolyMeatballs.org, or at http://spotlight.macfound.org/main/entry/adults_role_online_teen_spaces
JayClostermann: Hi, I'm Jay Clostermann.
JayClostermann: I am an active Global Kids volunteer.
Barry Gkid: Today we have invited many of those participates back this afternoon/morning/evening to revisit the issues in a live discussion.
Barry Gkid: I will be asking questions and they will be using the lightbulbs above their head to line-up to respond. Later on we will give you your OWN lightbub for the questions and answer period.
Barry Gkid: Before we begin, I'd like to ask each panelist to introduce themselves. This is also a good time to test out the lightbulbs!
Barry Gkid: So please click your bulb
Barry Gkid: and in the order shown above the White GK box, please introduce yourselves
Barry Gkid: Jay?
Jay Clostermann: I find it easier to only volunteer in the online spaces that Global Kids provides, which is why I am against taking these spaces away.
Lucky Figtree: Hello :] I'm Lucky Figtree. I was active in the Camp Global Kids as a reporter, and since then I have been working with the Global Kids in Real-Life.
Barry Gkid: And when you are done introducing yourself
Barry Gkid: please click your bulb
Barry Gkid: so the next person knows to go
Lucky Figtree: I'm often called on for events such as this one :P
Mariel Voyunicef: Hi. My name is Mariel, I'm 17 and I live in Mexico City. I "met" SL because of UNICEF and Global Kids' joint project "A World Fit for Children Festival".
RavenAnn Tiger: Hi :D im ravenann tiger and I’m NOT apart of global kids because i dont think adults should be allowed on the grid
Ryan Mauriac: Hi I'm Ryan Mauirac
Ryan Mauriac: I was apart of camp global kids summer 2006, i also joined in on the world fit for childern :)
Barry Gkid: Thank you all for joining us
Barry Gkid: The panelists will be asked to address a number of questions
Barry Gkid: both for and against adults in teen spaces
Barry Gkid: and then we will give all of YOU in the audience light bulbs and invite you to join us
Barry Gkid: So, after I ask the question, let's use the same process
Barry Gkid: if you want to answer please click your bulb
Barry Gkid: when done, please unclick it
Barry Gkid: If you want to RESPOND to something another panelists said, feel free to reclick your bulb
Barry Gkid: Question 1: What can adults offer to teen spaces?
Camari Beaton: ao off
Jay Clostermann: In teen spaces, adults can offer education, fun, and creative outlits.
Lucky Figtree: I think that adults can offer a lot of leadership, and set goals for teens. They're there to help us, and educate.
Mariel Voyunicef: I think adults can offer in virtual spaces the same things they offer offline without the barriers that exist there.
Ryan Mauriac: Adults can share their wisdom on how the world is, and bring up topics that we'll have to deal with when were adults.

Barry Gkid: Second question: What does their presence take away?
Barry Gkid: What does the presence of adults prevent from happening?
RavenAnn Tiger: I think that adults can prevent teenagers from having fun because they expect us to act certain ways when we're usually the total opposite
RavenAnn Tiger: (hold I’m on the phone)
RavenAnn Tiger: hold on*
Barry Gkid: Please say more
Barry Gkid: lol. okay, we'll come back to you
Lucky Figtree: I don't think it takes away too much, but having adults and educators around may create a problem of being themselves; as well. Adults can often be intimidating, and teens have a tendency of acting a certain way around them.
Lucky Figtree: [teens being themselves]
Mariel Voyunicef: The strange feeling of "ownership" that we tend to have when we're in teen-only places, perhaps.
Barry Gkid: Where do you think that comes from? That sense of ownership? And why is it important?
Jay Clostermann: Perhaps, teens have a rebellion against adults, which somewhat makes them mentally lose independence.
Mariel Voyunicef: I think it comes as a response to the ownership adults have of certain things because of legal reasons.
Barry Gkid: And RavenAnn, are you back from the phone yet?
Mariel Voyunicef: I think it is important because, after all, it is something that shows the impact of laws on youth, and I think it comes down only to personal choice whether this feeling of ownership should prevent adults from being on the TG or not.
RavenAnn Tiger: k I’m off the phone
Barry Gkid: I'd like to push more on this topic - why do you think teens gain from having a space they can call their own?
Jay Clostermann: Teens possibly could gain from having a place called their own for the reason that it would help them mentally gain 'imaginary independence'.
Jay Clostermann: Because Second Life is a virtual space.
Barry Gkid: Why do you qualify that by saying imaginary?
Barry Gkid: RavenAnn, sounds like you are back
Barry Gkid: Please tell us what was on your mind
RavenAnn Tiger: ok well teenagers like to have their own space to feel independant since they have had to live for so many years under someone else's rules. We like to be able to think for ourselves every now and then
RavenAnn Tiger: Parents and other adults usually tell us what to do and how to do it
sam Doigts: but we need someone to keep us inline
sam Doigts: we have all seen how bad the sandbox can get
Isadora Petrova: i think also it gets us ready for the real world u know
Lucky Figtree: Teens obviously gain a huge sense of freedom, and responsibility. Although, it's in a virtual world; And while some aspects may be quite similar or the real world, many are not. They gain independence, that may help when they're older; but much of what is learned is based on something much different than the Real World, and therefore much of what is gained in a virtual space can't be used in the real world.
Barry Gkid: So are you saying this indepances learned in a virtual world like TSl does not translate offline?
Barry Gkid: If not, why not?
Lucky Figtree: As I said, some is taken from SL into RL; but you can't use eveything that you learn in TSL in RL.
Lyle Zabelin: yes it is
Picard Zhu: Yes that is true
RavenAnn Tiger: shh
Barry Gkid: Before we move on, what is an example of something you CAN talk from TSL into the real world?
Isadora Petrova: i think people gain confidence from sl
Jay Clostermann: Please, if you are in the audience, please wait for the audience's turn to talk.
Ryan Mauriac: huh? just got confused xD
Barry Gkid: What does the presence of adults take away from youth when in a teen-only space?
Ryan Mauriac: There presence takes away creativity that they want to express, even if there no adult run sims like global kids adults would still be in second life in form of the lindens.
Ryan Mauriac: Lindens often tell us what we can do or what we cant do.
Ryan Mauriac: Giveing us rules to obey and follow.
aviator1223 Ascot: i got banned for 4 hours cussing one out
Isadora Petrova: lol
Isadora Petrova: besides if it weren’t for them u wouldn’t be here
Jay Clostermann: Shh, isadora.
Mariel Voyunicef: Well - from the little experience I have from teaching practices, I can tell that this sense of ownership is really needed when you want to get a message through. When people have this feeling, they seem to be more comfortable with the environment itself, which I think is the success of SL -and perhaps the reason why we're debating this today-. I wouldn't know about something that goes beyond that.
Mariel Voyunicef: Also, if you let me respond to Lucky's comment here, I do think that perhaps not all the knowledge you gain in TSL can be transmitted, as she said, offline (I don't like calling it RL) - however, I do think that you can transmit all the SKILLS you gain here (excuse the caps, needed to stress it).
Barry Gkid: So skills translate, but not always knowledge
Barry Gkid: What sort of skills? What sort of knowledge?
RavenAnn Tiger: Well, about you asking what skills we take out
Jay Clostermann: It can give you architectural skills.
RavenAnn Tiger: Into the real world if you make clothes for sl, like myself, you learn to be a better artist irl
RavenAnn Tiger: i don’t think building can make you take anything into the real world
RavenAnn Tiger: but scripting can also help, im not sure how cause im not a scripter, but its usually the smarter people who do script
Camari Beaton: scripting helps understand computer code for who ever wants a career working with computers
Mariel Voyunicef: Knowledge in terms of information - perhaps the things we learn accidentally, in general. Perhaps the basis of programming, even architectural (??) styles, haha, marketing.
Mariel Voyunicef: Skills - all of them. From social (because, after all, it's a second life indeed) to even better spatial relationships (building here does offline magic for real), marketing again... Better mental structures... All that.
Jay Clostermann: I'd say SL gives you computer skills, obviously.
Jay Clostermann: But the biggest skills you can learn are math, architecture, some physics, and computer code.
Jay Clostermann: Building in SL has gained me my love of architecture.
Barry Gkid: So on this topic, do you think the presence of adults could HELP you develop this skills? Do you think the presence of adults hinders you from learning them? What would you preferring an ideal TSL?
Barry Gkid: *in an ideal TSL?
Barry Gkid: Do adults help or hurt the learning?
Barry Gkid: and in what ways?
Lucky Figtree: Adults can be a huge help. They can help you learn such skills as we just talked about; and give you a better idea on how you can use the in the real world, or offline.
RavenAnn Tiger: Adults can both help or hurt, some adults could really help you with your building issues or if your having troubles in real life, but others don’t want anything to do with it
Mariel Voyunicef: Definitely! I think that, instead of hurting the feeling, online education might relieve the wounds made by offline education or even everyday offline circumstances. I don't think this is reduced to adult educators, but covers all types of educators.
Isadora Petrova: this is TEEN second life were TEENS can interact and share there ideas with other teens,there shouldn’t be adults on because its defeating the entire purpose of TEEN sl i feel like this is sort of my only place to express myself and when u add adults to that everything gets everything messed up
Malarthi Behemoth: Pardon me whilst I rez.
Ryan Mauriac: most adults will share thier knowledge with most teens, thus teaching us a lot more then we could learn on our own.

Barry Gkid: Well, let me follow-up with this question? Do you find the learning you do in TSL fun?
Barry Gkid: And, if so, does the presence of adults change that? And, finally, if so, is there anything you would want to tell adults so that they CAN help out but without changing the sense of fun and play?
RavenAnn Tiger: I do find the learning i get in tsl fun because of how i get to stay home and be comfortable while talking to many people from all over the world who know more than we do in just our small confined cities and towns, you can learn some interesting facts from both adults and teens, some helpful some just fun facts
Jay Clostermann: Wait.
Jay Clostermann: I forgot the question.
Jay Clostermann: Oh wait.
Jay Clostermann: Absolutely.
Jay Clostermann: It's funner than heck.
Jay Clostermann: (yes, I'm a nerd.).
Ryan Mauriac: Yes the learning i do in tsl is fun, adults don't change a thing most adults that are in tsl are lindens all the other are in private sims like global kids, we have the choice to go there and interact and learn from them.
Mariel Voyunicef: Well - I think that, after all, this is an issue people will never agree on because, after all, it all comes down to personal experience and tastes in this case. I do think, though, that to please both parties adults should continue to give opportunities like this to the ones interested in e-education, and at the same time never impose the models on the teens who aren't willing. I think this demands flexibility from both sides.
RavenAnn Tiger: (bathroom break brb)
Ryan Mauriac: my choice was clearly to learn and interact with the adults in second life.

Barry Gkid: Final question
Barry Gkid: before going to the audience
Barry Gkid: But before I ask it I want to say this has been a fantastic panel and we appreciate each of you spending the time to share your thoughts here
Barry Gkid: We also appreciate those in the audience who have been patient andbeen listening
Barry Gkid: and we look forward to shortly learning what is on your minds
Barry Gkid: last question:
Barry Gkid: When is it not safe for teens to not have adults around online?
Jay Clostermann: It isn't safe for teens to not have adults online when it is an EXTREMELY large game, with tons of potential predators, e.g Second Life.
RavenAnn Tiger: I dont think adults should have many adults if any besides lindens on the teen grid because of predators, I’m not sure if I’m speaking for anyone else here but im paranoid and i hate when adults are around me that i don’t know or that my friends don’t know :)
RavenAnn Tiger: i don’t think adults should be on the tg*
RavenAnn Tiger: I agree with ryan :)
Ryan Mauriac: It's not safe when they pretend to be teens so they can access TSL with out being a Certifiable adult, the best type of adult to do this would be a online predator trying to get a teen to meet them, Myself can say i have never had such a thing happen to me before, as long as LL dose background checks on Certifiable adults then we should be safe :)
Mariel Voyunicef: Well, I can sadly say because of personal experience that predators are a risk always in online places, so I second what has been said. :)
Barry Gkid: We have found some consensus, agreement. Yeah!
Barry Gkid: With that, we will give mariel the last word
Barry Gkid: before Mercury turns on the red boc
Barry Gkid: when the red box is turned on, you can click and get you OWN lightbulb
Barry Gkid: wear it. Click it. And then your name will appear on the list
Mariel Voyunicef: Also, I'd like to give a final message to everyone - please remember this is a debate where two different viewpoints are supposed to reach a solution for the problem, so we all should be flexible.
Ryan Mauriac: Brb washroom :)
Barry Gkid: let me remind everyone that is the first of two weeks celebrating Global Kids' one year anniversary in the teen grid
Lucky Figtree: Yay! Happy Rezday!
Barry Gkid: Please click on the red box
Barry Gkid: Then put on your lightbulb
Barry Gkid: and if you are number 1 please either ask a question of the panel or share your own thoughts
Barry Gkid: when you are done please click your lightbulb again
Barry Gkid: IF you are number 2 or 3 please start typing what you want to say in advance
[Fur.Tool] v2.4: Scripter: Bhavin Poindexter - Designers: Inuyasha Overlord & Reggie Clifton
Case Damone: I believe, that adults play a major role in second life.
Case Damone: But, they could definitely interfere with the creativity of the teens.
Barry Gkid: Case, Please say more. In what way?
Takura Thielt: I think adults should be allowed on TSL but only a select few with full background checks. They could help us with scripting, building, etc.
Case Damone: Well. What if someone was building something, and an adult came up, and said, "No no, you do it this way." It could really mess around. Also, a lot of teens use TSL to get -away- from adults. Just to be with people that could have the same thoughts as them.
Isadora Petrova: i feel that teen second life is a place for teens to interact and hang out, its one of the only places i have that’s my own so i feel like having adults interfere makes everything harder although i do think that case has a point about a few adults that can help u maybe four or five people that the lindens have met personally
Isadora Petrova: really quickly can everyone in the audience say yay or nay to having adults in the TG
Bellia Zou: yay
Davidius Drake: nay
Isadora Petrova: ok so far we have 3 nats annnnnnnnd 7 yays
Jay Clostermann: Yay.
Joe GKid: yay
RavenAnn Tiger: nay, unless its lindens
Ryan Mauriac: YAY!!!!
Takura Thielt: yay
Barry Gkid: Interesting. Good sense of the "room". Good idea Isadora. Thank you
RavenAnn Tiger: do you think that people moving to the mg from the tg should have a choice to move? some people dont want to move if they have so many friends here who are leaving in a year for the mg or so and want to wait for them
Barry Gkid: While ISadora prepares her comment, Jay why don't you go ahead
Jay Clostermann: Well...
Jay Clostermann: I would say that adults may cause some stress on the teens.
Jay Clostermann: The adults have seen the MG, and what perfection in the catagory of builds and resident made items it brings.
Isadora Petrova: well i feel like some people have thoughts that they r uncomfortable sharing with adults, so tsl is a place t share there ideas without adults, so i feel like some of the adults on the tg are being mean and taking teens fun also, some of the adults i have met have been weird and mean so i think several people over the TG have several opinioms so i think I’m gonna go and prepare to have a vote if u don’t mind
Jay Clostermann: TG residents do not have the experience to match that, which is why some of the TSL approved adults believe that our items don't match the quality that the MG's items do.
Jay Clostermann: Thus, the adults push for more and more perfection, which puts teens under stress.
Valenteen Gastel: Certain Adults should be allowed in TSL, but on special conditions and restrictions. Meaning, they should only be here to help us, not to look over us like every other adult we've known. What I mean by conditions and restrictions is having them in one certain place and not roaming around TSL, that way if teens WANT to be helped they can go to that certain place to get it.
Barry Gkid: Thank you for coming and sharing Isadora. Your comments and everyone else's in the public chat can be seen later at holymeatballs.org
Malarthi Behemoth: Well, I'll say that in blatant self interest, I'm leaving soon, and honestly, it's not a thing I look forward to. I helped found this place, I don't want to leave. If adults can't be here, I'd be locked out forever.
Malarthi Behemoth: And that's... Well... Not something I'd want @.@
Malarthi Behemoth: I think that I personally, and people like myself, have a lot to offer to the "new generation" of TSL residents.
Barry Gkid: very true. Someday everyone in the current teen grid will be adults -it is an interesting issue to think about what that will mean for both grids at that time
Takura Thielt: I think adults should be allowed on TSL but only a select few with full background checks. They could help us with scripting, building, etc.
Takura Thielt: also
Takura Thielt: they could help the older teens (about 14-17) with jobs..
Takura Thielt: like I've read things on other websites about big businesses hiring people through SL
Malarthi Behemoth: I'm not supposed to be on the list, it's broken >.<
Mariel Voyunicef: I think we should keep in mind the situations in which adults make us stressed. Personally, I wouldn't compare SL, a place where you can leave elsewhere whenever you want, to a classroom where you must stay in the class no matter your opinion of the teacher.
Mariel Voyunicef: And about the current system - well, personally, I wouldn't have any problem if adults went around the other sims; however, I do think that, in order to respect both parties (those for and those against adults here), the current system is the fairest.
Valenteen Gastel: I believe this system works fine. Teens come here by choice, knowing that there adults here.
Barry Gkid: Thank you Takura
Barry Gkid: So popcorn style - let it pop!
Barry Gkid: 60seconds
Jay Clostermann: I think the system works fine. Though, possibly, if a friend of a TSL approved adult comes to TSL, and then is told by an adult friend that THEY have an educational island on the same grid, maybe there should be an exception for them to be allowed to those islands only.
Malarthi Behemoth: It's true Takura. But that's a problem I've grappled with since I started thinking about it.
Malarthi Behemoth: You can't stop them getting in anyway.
RyanMauriac: teens have been living with adults in secondlife even before tsl teens would fake their age to get on the mg to play sl, we infact do have the same quality items they have.
Takura Thielt: bad thing about adults on TG... one bad thing
Takura Thielt: predators
Takura Thielt: I'm sure there might be a few other things but...
Barry Gkid: 30 seconds
Barry Gkid: 20 seconds
Barry Gkid: 10 seconds
Jay Clostermann: BLAST OFF!
Takura Thielt: 9
Takura Thielt: 8
Takura Thielt: 7
Valenteen Gastel: Predators true, but keeping adults in one place lowers the chances of that
Barry Gkid: 6
Barry Gkid: 5
Barry Gkid: 4
Barry Gkid: 3
Barry Gkid: 2
Barry Gkid: 1
Barry Gkid: Thank you everyone. This has been a fascinating and rich conversation
Barry Gkid: We will edit it for clarity and post it int he next few days at our blog where many of you post:
Barry Gkid: http://www.HolyMeatballs.org
Jay Clostermann: yAy!
Barry Gkid: Feel free to continue the conversation there in the comment section
Barry Gkid: Please remember - big event tomorrow at 4pm SL time - Blue Linden and a special quest on the past present and future of the teen grid
Barry Gkid: Plus the winner of the cake contest
Barry Gkid: cake contest*
Barry Gkid: next week we will have the volcano erupt,
Barry Gkid: two live event, one with voice and one with voice and sound
Barry Gkid: Check the Global Kid group notices for the schedule
Barry Gkid: thank you to all of the TSL residents who have helped make this event and continue to make this festival so fun.
Barry Gkid: Night everyone!
Barry Gkid: Oh, and thank you to all of the panelist!
Jay Clostermann: :D.
Jay Clostermann: MUCH better than I expected.
Malarthi Behemoth: And NOW I rez.
Ryan Mauriac: :)
Ryan Mauriac: Anytime barry
Ryan Mauriac: it was a great debate